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Documentation about the Vampire hardware

Using Cyclone V GX Starter Kit As a Standalone V4?

Millicent Byestander

Posts 1
20 Sep 2017 23:06


It looks like one of the Cyclone V dev kits has the necessary stats and all the non-trivial ports on it for it to be a standalone Vampire V4. It uses a 5CGXFC5C6F27C7N Cyclone V, even has buttons if you can't fix a DB9 connector for it. Looks like it costs around €175 and seems to be available in a lot of places.


Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
20 Sep 2017 23:15


Dont mix existing on sales Cyclone V basns like a Standalone Vamp.
That does not make sense.
EXTERNAL LINK 
wait few months more.


Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 6207
20 Sep 2017 23:38


Millicent Byestander wrote:

It looks like one of the Cyclone V dev kits has the necessary stats and all the non-trivial ports on it for it to be a standalone Vampire V4. It uses a 5CGXFC5C6F27C7N Cyclone V, even has buttons if you can't fix a DB9 connector for it. Looks like it costs around €175 and seems to be available in a lot of places.

I understand your thinking we also had the same.
Especially if you think about that the FPGA alone on this board - has saled price of 170,-

We had the same idea some time ago.
But learned that this has a lot of uncertainty.
Those boards are sold under production cost for marketing.
The purpose is to attract some student to the vendor.

We learned that starting a product on those marketing boards is tricky. These cards are often only done for a certain period of time. Also these prices are for marketing.
We look at such a boards before - it was also sold under production cost - when we started to use it after some month the vendor did trippled the board sales price. 




Roy Gillotti

Posts 517
20 Sep 2017 23:42


Millicent Byestander wrote:

  It looks like one of the Cyclone V dev kits has the necessary stats and all the non-trivial ports on it for it to be a standalone Vampire V4. It uses a 5CGXFC5C6F27C7N Cyclone V, even has buttons if you can't fix a DB9 connector for it. Looks like it costs around ¤175 and seems to be available in a lot of places.
 

 
  Also can't really expect the an Apollo core to just work out of the box with some random development board. I/Os would be completely different, for example the IOs going the Joystick ports in the V4 Apollo-core could be going to some SATA port on this FPGA board things like that.
 
  Ninja'd by Gunnar.




M Rickan

Posts 177
21 Sep 2017 01:48


Roy Gillotti wrote:

Also can't really expect the an Apollo core to just work out of the box with some random development board...

No, but it does point out the option of the Apollo core being used on a wider range of devices than just the Vampire.

If the Apollo is genuinely available to be licensed for use in other products and is a project that is independent of the Vampire, it leaves open a lot of possibilities.



Renaud Schweingruber
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 378
21 Sep 2017 09:25


I'd add to Gunnar statement that using such board Apollo Team would lose control over the lifecycle of the product : if Altera choose to EOL it, we'd have to wait for another card from them, port the core, etc.
With a customized and optimized board like V4, we merge lifecycle management of both core and hardware.
 
Then, selling our own board bring Apollo Team financial benefits that we wouldn't get using off-the-shelves boards. Those benefits are there to finance development of current and future products.


Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 6207
21 Sep 2017 09:34


Renaud Schweingruber wrote:

I'd add to Gunnar statement that using such board we would lose control over the lifecycle of the product :

Yes.

I think one very important part of the VAMPIRE is that we continuously improve the cores for them.

For example we are relative proud that our memory controller is better than INTELs/ALTERAs own memory controller.

You will have noticed the excellent memory performance of the VAMP-2. The reason is that for the VAMPIRE-2 we did spend significant time to improve memory performance.

I have seen ALTERA devs boards after some month from one revision of the next change their memory chips.

Spending several month on tuning memory controller speed for a certain card - does only make sense if you can be sure the same card will be produced for a long amount of time.


Mallagan Bellator

Posts 393
21 Sep 2017 18:27


I do believe it will be produced for a long time


Thierry Atheist

Posts 644
21 Sep 2017 19:12


People are asking you to open source your stuff PRECISELY BECAUSE equipment of this type is available. Their goal is to circumvent you price wise, and leave you with NOTHING for all the work you've done.

I oppose open source. Open source NONE of your works.

Open source it LONG AFTER* you at some point may decide to abandon the project.

* If you ever feel that you want to.


Mallagan Bellator

Posts 393
21 Sep 2017 19:17


I fully agree!!!


Thierry Atheist

Posts 644
21 Sep 2017 19:20


Mallagan Bellator wrote:
I do believe it will be produced for a long time

P.S. I thought (think?) you were referring to the Cyclone V GX Starter Kit.

Yeah, but as Gunnar said (about the Cyclone V GX Starter Kit), if some new chip comes along that can replace two or three, or they get a deal on some RAM chips, etc. they have NO LOYALTY to producing a 100% compatible clone of the previous offering. They'll alter the circuitry in a heartbeat if it can save them $5 per board when they do a run.

Also, should there be a flaw they can pinpoint it, as they are in complete control of the layout.

It's not about being "a control freak", but about quality, reliability and performance!!!! (Amongst a slew of other things.)


Mallagan Bellator

Posts 393
21 Sep 2017 19:27


Ah, no. I misunderstood. I thought he was talking about the vampire

posts 12