The team will post updates and news about our project here |
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| | Gunnar von Boehn (Apollo Team Member) Posts 6254 21 May 2018 16:42
| A1200 coder wrote:
| The memory bandwidth of AGA @ 28MB/sec seems impressive,
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Apollo/Saga and Vamp are very good in Memory bandwidth AGA in AMIGA had max 28 MB/s SAGA in Vamp has 700 MB/s
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| | Matthew Langtry
Posts 199 21 May 2018 17:09
| wow 25 times the memory bandwidth of a1200 aga chipset
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| | Vojin Vidanovic (Needs Verification) Posts 1916/ 1 21 May 2018 17:32
| Matthew Langtry wrote:
| wow 25 times the memory bandwidth of a1200 aga chipset |
Modern memory controller, actually its not that far from that now and is faster then PA Semi and G4 :-)AMIGA BUSTEST - READL Score ------------------------------------------ VAMPIRE 2 658.9 / 529.5 MB/sec (world record!) x1000 AMIGA-1 PA6T 1800 MHz 285.6 MB/sec MOS IBook PPC G4 1400 MHz 185.4 MB/sec MOS MacMini PPC G4 1500 MHz 184.3 MB/sec OS4 SAM PPC 460 1100 MHz 109.7 MB/sec OS4 SAM PPC 440 667 MHz 91.1 MB/sec OS4 Peg2 PPC G4 1000 MHz 80.6 MB/sec CyberStormPPC 68060@50 55.1 MB/sec Apollo 1240 68040@40 47.8 MB/sec FPGA ARCADE 29.0 MB/sec Blizzard 1230 68030@50 24.3 MB/sec Typhoon MK2 68030@40 18.8 MB/sec AMIGA 4000 68040@25 11.5 MB/sec AMIGA 1200 ACA 1220 10.9 MB/sec Zeus 68000 50 Mhz 9.1 MB/sec CLICK HERE Hoping to see v4 results with even faster memory.
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| | Renaud Schweingruber (Apollo Team Member) Posts 381 22 May 2018 21:12
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| | Tim D
Posts 84 23 May 2018 09:51
| Awesome to see that Gold 3 release isn't far off anymore and it already includes Pamela! Guess I'll have to get me an DIGITAL-VIDEO audio splitter though, to be able to make use of the DIGITAL-VIDEO audio.
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| | Rod March
Posts 119 23 May 2018 09:52
| First: Awesome, awesome job team, this ROCKS! I can't wait to see it (and order a V4 too!) Now two questions: 1) Right now I still use my RGB monitor rather than the DIGITAL-VIDEO out, I realize to get SAGA I will have to use the DIGITAL-VIDEO, but will I still be able to use the RGB out from my Amiga? Or will it stop working altogether once I flash with GOLD3? 2) My understanding is that SAGA is an accelerated AGA core - faster chips, faster chip mem, and more of it. Is there a 'compatability mode' to stop old games running too fast, and a 'Vampire mode' to run the chipset faster for new games? Or can it auto-detect what software is timing dependent? Or do you guys have an even smarter solution? Just curious...
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| | Ronnie Beck
Posts 37 23 May 2018 11:36
| Rod March wrote:
| 1) Right now I still use my RGB monitor rather than the DIGITAL-VIDEO out, I realize to get SAGA I will have to use the DIGITAL-VIDEO, but will I still be able to use the RGB out from my Amiga? Or will it stop working altogether once I flash with GOLD3?
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So the AGA chipset will be on the Vampire card's FPGA chip and essentially bypass the ECS/OCS chips on your Amiga's board. As such, the RGB port will no longer be used. Actually that is an implied goal of all this. No more scandoublers! Everything over DIGITAL-VIDEO. Yay!! Maybe the Apollo Team could offer a "Use Onboard Chips" option for those who would like to use the RGB still, with the caveat that you will only have OCS/ECS. I am sure someone will argue the need for that. Rod March wrote:
| 2) My understanding is that SAGA is an accelerated AGA core - faster chips, faster chip mem, and more of it. Is there a 'compatability mode' to stop old games running too fast, and a 'Vampire mode' to run the chipset faster for new games? Or can it auto-detect what software is timing dependent? Or do you guys have an even smarter solution? Just curious...
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I think this has been proposed already. If I can be naughty and extrapolate from BigGun's comments in IRC: <BigGun> yes there are 3 types of games <BigGun> a) games which ran 100% speed on A500 and sync to VBL <BigGun> they will not change <BigGun> b) games which not synced to VBL, they will get faster, this can be controlled on VAMP by using turttle mode <BigGun> c) games which run not smooth because A500/A4000 was to slow <BigGun> those will ran much smoother So my conjecture is that, turtle mode would be extended to slowing down the AGA implementation as well. But let's wait and see how it looks when it gets here.
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| | Gunnar von Boehn (Apollo Team Member) Posts 6254 23 May 2018 12:13
| Ronnie Beck wrote:
| So my conjecture is that, turtle mode would be extended to slowing down the AGA implementation as well. But let's wait and see how it looks when it gets here.
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Yes, the VAMP will per default run fast. The Vamp is about 15-20 times faster than a typical 68030 Accelerator. Turtle-Mode will allow to run the machine in legacy game speed mode. You can switch to Turtle mode using a CLI command or with "NoCache" Tooltype in WHDLOAD. Turtle Mode should give roughly A1200 with 68020@28MHz speed. Turtle mode will slow down the Vamp roughly by Factor / 30 Demanding games like DOOM/Quake should be run without Turtle mode for highest FPS. Turle-mode will certainly be tweaked more in the future but works already good. For example, HYBRIS which used to sometimes suffer from to fast Music - plays now really perfect. Hybris never looked so good on Vamp before.
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| | Sean Sk
Posts 488 23 May 2018 15:19
| Ronnie Beck wrote:
| So the AGA chipset will be on the Vampire card's FPGA chip and essentially bypass the ECS/OCS chips on your Amiga's board. As such, the RGB port will no longer be used. Actually that is an implied goal of all this. No more scandoublers! Everything over DIGITAL-VIDEO. Yay!! Maybe the Apollo Team could offer a "Use Onboard Chips" option for those who would like to use the RGB still, with the caveat that you will only have OCS/ECS. I am sure someone will argue the need for that. |
I could be wrong but I believe there will still be a choice as to whether a user wants to use the AGA chipset and output video through DIGITAL-VIDEO or whether they want to use the ECS chipset and output video through RGB. Obviously you won't be able to use AGA out through RGB, but for me that doesn't matter. I have an A600 with a V600 and would like to continue to use the ECS chipset primarily because I would like to still use it with a nice large 100Hz CRT TV that I'm using. It has a beautiful picture. For AGA I still have an A1200 which is definitely going to have a Vampire 1200 V4 put into it when it gets released, and that will satisfy my need for SAGA/AGA out through DIGITAL-VIDEO to a LCD monitor.
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| | Vojin Vidanovic (Needs Verification) Posts 1916/ 1 23 May 2018 15:33
| sean sk wrote:
| No more scandoublers! Everything over DIGITAL-VIDEO. Yay!! Maybe the Apollo Team could offer a "Use Onboard Chips" option for those who would like to use the RGB still, with the caveat that you will only have OCS/ECS. I am sure someone will argue the need for that.
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We will see, but option to flash 2.9 where RGB can be used, remains.
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| | Gunnar von Boehn (Apollo Team Member) Posts 6254 23 May 2018 16:36
| Vojin Vidanovic wrote:
| sean sk wrote:
| No more scandoublers! Everything over DIGITAL-VIDEO. Yay!! Maybe the Apollo Team could offer a "Use Onboard Chips" option for those who would like to use the RGB still, with the caveat that you will only have OCS/ECS. I am sure someone will argue the need for that. |
We will see, but option to flash 2.9 where RGB can be used, remains. |
Main goal of Gold 3.0 is to give you AGA. If you do not want to use AGA but like to stay with OCS on RGB port - then you should for now continue with Gold 2.X
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| | Mo Retro
Posts 241 23 May 2018 21:47
| Gunnar von Boehn wrote:
| Main goal of Gold 3.0 is to give you AGA. If you do not want to use AGA but like to stay with OCS on RGB port - then you should for now continue with Gold 2.X
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Is there any certainty that we will get AGA and FPU in core 3 for the V2? Or do we have to choose also between core 2.9 and 3? Thanks in advance for replying.
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| | Knight Stone (Needs Verification) Posts 136/ 1 24 May 2018 00:36
| What Gunnar is saying is, Gold 3 will have AGA and other things like chipmem size etc, and that the whole point of Gold 3, is AGA. If you want to use a CRT, you have two choices. stick with 2.9, and use the RGB, with no AGA stick with Gold 3, if you want sound over DIGITAL-VIDEO AND AGA. The AGA will ONLY output across DIGITAL-VIDEO, not RGB Somone kindly posted a DIGITAL-VIDEO box, that converts the audio to optical/RCA and video to SCART, i like using my 1084, so this is the route i will take. So that's the bottom line, you can have AGA through DIGITAL-VIDEO, or ECS/OCS across RGB, but you can't have both. If you want RGB from the Amiga, then its 2.9 only, and no Gold 3. i would assume the great work done on the FPU and all that, will still remain
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| | Mo Retro
Posts 241 24 May 2018 01:39
| Knight Stone wrote:
| What Gunnar is saying is, Gold 3 will have AGA and other things like chipmem size etc, and that the whole point of Gold 3, is AGA. If you want to use a CRT, you have two choices. stick with 2.9, and use the RGB, with no AGA stick with Gold 3, if you want sound over DIGITAL-VIDEO AND AGA. The AGA will ONLY output across DIGITAL-VIDEO, not RGB Somone kindly posted a DIGITAL-VIDEO box, that converts the audio to optical/RCA and video to SCART, i like using my 1084, so this is the route i will take. So that's the bottom line, you can have AGA through DIGITAL-VIDEO, or ECS/OCS across RGB, but you can't have both. If you want RGB from the Amiga, then its 2.9 only, and no Gold 3. i would assume the great work done on the FPU and all that, will still remain |
I did understand that Knight Stone but there were some rumours that AGA and the FPU couldn't fit in the V2's FPGA. That's why I wanted a confirmation if that's s the case.
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| | Knight Stone (Needs Verification) Posts 136/ 1 24 May 2018 02:48
| Mo Retro wrote:
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Knight Stone wrote:
| What Gunnar is saying is, Gold 3 will have AGA and other things like chipmem size etc, and that the whole point of Gold 3, is AGA. If you want to use a CRT, you have two choices. stick with 2.9, and use the RGB, with no AGA stick with Gold 3, if you want sound over DIGITAL-VIDEO AND AGA. The AGA will ONLY output across DIGITAL-VIDEO, not RGB Somone kindly posted a DIGITAL-VIDEO box, that converts the audio to optical/RCA and video to SCART, i like using my 1084, so this is the route i will take. So that's the bottom line, you can have AGA through DIGITAL-VIDEO, or ECS/OCS across RGB, but you can't have both. If you want RGB from the Amiga, then its 2.9 only, and no Gold 3. i would assume the great work done on the FPU and all that, will still remain |
I did understand that Knight Stone but there were some rumours that AGA and the FPU couldn't fit in the V2's FPGA. That's why I wanted a confirmation if that's s the case.
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gotcha, my apologies. The FPU must be present, some of the AGA demo's i've seen running require it, so i am pretty sure it's there, but you're right, confirmation would be good.
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| | Mallagan Bellator
Posts 393 24 May 2018 19:45
| Knight Stone wrote:
| Mo Retro wrote:
| Knight Stone wrote:
| What Gunnar is saying is, Gold 3 will have AGA and other things like chipmem size etc, and that the whole point of Gold 3, is AGA. If you want to use a CRT, you have two choices. stick with 2.9, and use the RGB, with no AGA stick with Gold 3, if you want sound over DIGITAL-VIDEO AND AGA. The AGA will ONLY output across DIGITAL-VIDEO, not RGB Somone kindly posted a DIGITAL-VIDEO box, that converts the audio to optical/RCA and video to SCART, i like using my 1084, so this is the route i will take. So that's the bottom line, you can have AGA through DIGITAL-VIDEO, or ECS/OCS across RGB, but you can't have both. If you want RGB from the Amiga, then its 2.9 only, and no Gold 3. i would assume the great work done on the FPU and all that, will still remain |
I did understand that Knight Stone but there were some rumours that AGA and the FPU couldn't fit in the V2's FPGA. That's why I wanted a confirmation if that's s the case. |
gotcha, my apologies. The FPU must be present, some of the AGA demo's i've seen running require it, so i am pretty sure it's there, but you're right, confirmation would be good. |
I’m not 100% sure, but I think someone said the core was reworked to fit the whole FPU in the V2 FPGA, so if AGA was fitted in, maybe Femu could be used in addition like before, with the most important FPU instructions in hardware. It’s true that the talk used to be “FPGA too small to fit it all”, I just don’t know if that’s still the case
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| | Gunnar von Boehn (Apollo Team Member) Posts 6254 25 May 2018 09:08
| The FPGA used in the Vampire-2 has a certain physical size. This physical size does currently not allow to fit the CPU, the FPU, and the complete SAGA/AGA++ chipset at the same time. This means the upcoming GOLD 3.0 alpha release will contain * fastest AMIGA memory controller * 68080 CPU * SAGA/AGA chipset It will provide video and audio over DIGITAL-VIDEO, and upgrade your chipmem. This release will allow to play OCS and AGA Amiga games on modern TVs.
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| | Tim D
Posts 84 25 May 2018 10:39
| So, that means for FPU dependent software? - Not gonna work - Can use Femu as Mallagan sais - other?
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| | Stefano Briccolani
Posts 586 25 May 2018 10:55
| In an Amiten episode I saw that the aga core beta Johnny was demonstrating in his vampire v2 had a working fpu (sysinfo gave 50 mflops so I doubt it was only software based). Maybe there will be an hybrid hw/sw fpu?
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| | Adam Whittaker (Needs Verification) Posts 270/ 1 25 May 2018 11:22
| so can we get a yes or no to FPU in AGA Core?
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